SPEAKERS
Carl Richards, Catherine Mattiske
Carl Richards 00:06
You've entered the Genius Zone where we explore the secrets to unlocking your Inner Genius. Your host, Catherine Mattiske brings her years of knowledge and experience in developing the Inner Genius Profile. Let's dive in and see what's in store for today. This podcast episode is taken from a previous live event.
Welcome everyone to the webinar Communicating With Impact: The Secret Structure For Presentations and Emails and Conversations as well. I'm Carl Richards and today we're joined by Catherine Mattiske, who is an international trainer who works with many of the world's largest organizations, and she's here to share her secrets to communicating with impact so we can all become better communicators. I have to say that I've spent my entire life dedicating that time to being a communicator, and I thought I knew everything there was to know about communication. And then I met Catherine Mattiske. And I quickly learned that there's so much more than I needed to learn.
So, Catherine has a wealth of experience in creating powerful presentations, crafting convincing emails and meaningful training programs as well for her clients. She is the creator of Inner Genius, and the Inner Genius Quotient. And today, she'll be discussing the mistakes preventing people from getting their message heard, we all want our messages to be heard, but we might not be hitting all the parts that we need to. So she will also provide easy to apply tips on successfully conveying information to other people using the Inner Genius Profile. So let's give a warm welcome to Catherine Mattiske. Thank you so much for being here today. Yes, give her a round of applause. Thank you, Catherine.
Catherine Mattiske 01:46
Hello, great to be with you, Carl and everybody else welcome.
Carl Richards 01:49
Let's get started by discussing why communication is often difficult. What are some of the common mistakes that prevent people from getting their message heard?
Catherine Mattiske 01:57
Well, I think right off the bat, I think the biggest mistake that I see people making is that they're not thinking about their audience, it's as simple as that. I think people just go through the motions of their presentation or their mail or when they're having conversations, and they don't actually think about it too much. Because we've been doing this all of our life. And it's really important to consider who you're talking to, and then I'd be able to adjust your communication accordingly. Now, that's a skill, and many people don't have that skill. Some people are okay at it. Some people are great at it, but many people fall short. So people often forget about the importance of tailoring their message to the specific context or situation, they end up saying way too much, or they end up saying not enough, quite frankly.
And so I think for today, what we want to focus on and if you think about your very next communication that you're making, if you're listening to this call, if you have to do a report, or you have to do a presentation, you have to do an email, you have to send a letter or an newsletter, whatever it is, you should always strive to make your message three things one clear, two concise, and three memorable, then you've at least got a chance of being heard on the other end.
Carl Richards 03:14
Why have you dedicated your career to learning about communication, learning and communication?
Catherine Mattiske 03:19
Well, I didn't really plan it to be that way to be honest, Carl, I started off in the computer industry. That's where I started. And I transitioned into training with the computer industry. And that was at the time when PCs were just coming out. And every person working for a business did Microsoft Word, Microsoft Excel, or Microsoft PowerPoint training, or all three, and I was that trainer. And so what I quickly came to realize is my communication, when I was standing in front of a training room, and they were the days before overhead projectors or anything like that, where I could actually demonstrate things, my communication was pretty bad. How did I know that? Because out of my 12 participants, eight of them didn't know what they were doing. And I thought, it's not them, it's me, the common denominator was me being the person who was sending the communication. So I then started to work out how to actually do a better job by finding out how people learn and how to communicate to their particular learning preference. And that's really propelled me for 30 years, and it's fascinated me for 30 years. And the more I know, the less I know that kind of old adage.
But I truly believe that communication is the absolute foundation to successful relationships, both personally and professionally. And you know, when people say "oh things have gone wrong!" And someone says- all the time, they say "all it comes down to communication." And then it's kind of like the end of the sentence, new paragraph to the page. It's like, how do we actually fix this? If everyone says "the problem is communication", let's get a solution to that communication. So, that's what's driven me all these years, and I see so many people struggling to express themselves and they're not being heard. It simply due to a lack of skill, and there's skills that you can learn. And that's why I've dedicated my entire career to helping people become effective communicators, both as trainers, coaches, consultants, people, leaders, you know, whoever they are, so they can build these meaningful connections. And ultimately, that means having a greater impact in the world. So that's what I've done. And so I've created the Inner Genius Profile, so that people can be more confident, they can be more courageous, they can be more capable communicators and say, "you know what, this is a skill, and it's a skill that I can learn."
Carl Richards 05:38
So what is your formula for crafting powerful communication?
Catherine Mattiske 05:42
Well, the first thing I wanted to do is make it simple, right? I'm from Australia. So, we're very kind of straightforward people, we say it how it is, and don't kind of create a whole lot of jargon. So in this whole communication sphere, there's a whole lot of science. And that's my first love, I suppose, that whole learning sites and how the brain works and how they manifest into people's communication. So I wanted to make it super simple.
So I created the Inner Genius Archetypes, and said that each person has their own communication language. So I believe, and science backs this up, that (each) person uses a subset of all the words in the language that they're speaking. And that subset is directly aligned with what I've called the Inner Genius Archetype. So imagine a printed dictionary. Now that lists all the available words. Now in English, that's approximately 170,000 words. However, of course, we don't use all of those words, we somewhere between 20 and 30,000 words, that's what we use out of that 170,000, generally. We are naturally though, tuned into words that we connect with. And they are the words that we use to speak and write.
So the words that you use Carl, out of your 20, or 30,000, might be very different to the words I use. And it doesn't matter that you're from Canada, and I'm from Australia, and it might be cultural, that has some bearing on it. But there's a bigger story here, we each have this secret language, and we all have one. And we use the words in our natural communication. Now we write how we speak. And we present all of our forms of communication is based on our own preferred subset of words, our secret language. And we do that because they resonate and connect with us. So that brings up a whole litany of questions of "Okay, so if we connect with us, then what about other people?" And there's a million questions in that, but let's just stick to this idea of this secret language first. And that secret language is attached to your own communication preference.
Carl Richards 08:01
Which would explain why if I'm speaking to somebody or sending an email that words that I'm using that are from my own secret language, the message might not be getting through the way I'm intending. So, how do people discover their secret language, their Inner Genius Archetype.
Catherine Mattiske 08:18
So it's really easy and I've made it easy. The first thing you do is get the Inner Genius Toolkit. And we'll put some links up to that. And first you take an online assessment, the Inner Genius Profile, takes you 10 minutes, okay? So it's super easy on the surface. Behind the scenes is the most incredibly complex algorithm ever, that I designed and we had programmed up. So when you do your Profile that opens up your Inner Genius Archetype Vault. And there you see your entire Toolkit full of materials, full of tools to help you communicate.
Carl Richards 08:51
Well, so many great tools in that kit, too. So, let's keep the discussion going. Catherine, because lots of people have already completed their Profile and they know their Archetype. What's their reaction when they find out?
Catherine Mattiske 09:03
Well, once you discover your Inner Genius Archetype, you realize your personal language, perhaps for the first time in your life, and yet you've been walking on the planet for however many years and you don't know this because no one's taught you. And chances are that your personal language then is different from the people that you work with, and different from your family members and different from your friends. And that's often why there's a disconnect between people or misunderstandings or having to clarify things, because you're speaking in your Archetype language, and they're speaking in their Archetype language. So it's a bit like speaking French to someone who's speaking German, like not much is actually resonating.
So when two people have different personal language preferences, they use that subset of words that I was talking about before that resonate with them. Now that can cause friction, it can cause miscommunication, it could cause misunderstandings. And then relationships start to get strained. And by connecting though, with other people's words and phrases by connecting with their Archetype and go, "okay, I get that you're different to me, that maybe I'm The Futurist and you're The Explorer, or I'm the Futurist and you're The Decrypter, or I'm the Futurist and you're The Horologist." By actually saying, "who's on the other end of this message that I'm sending?" Voice, email, whatever it is, and understanding these tools, I'm hoping that people and people are telling me, that they are better equipped to craft really authentic messages who're still themselves.
But it goes an extra step, it really engages, and it really inspires their audience. Be that one person, or be that 10,000 people (you) know, whoever their audience is. So it's really about learning the skill to say, "I'm gonna get out of my own way here and I'm going to start to bridge some of these communication gaps, even if I'm speaking to a very large group."
Carl Richards 11:03
So, is crafting authentic messages, then, for example, if you're using someone else's Archetype, not your own, is it challenging?
Catherine Mattiske 11:11
Yeah, it can be. It's a skill, though. And you can learn that skill, it takes a while. But you can learn that skill, there's easier ways to do that than actually trying to discover what somebody is like, if you've got a family, get your family to each do the Profile, if you've got a team work, get them to do the Profile, get the Toolkit and get your entire team to do the Profile. And then we create for you a Team Map to say, "okay, who's who." So you don't have to actually learn the skill of spotting someone's Archetype, it's actually easier than that. But the key is to understand that people communicate and then kind of adjust your communication accordingly, that you don't have to change at all. You don't have to change who you are. But it just takes practice.
And once you know, another person's Archetype, you'll be much better equipped to craft messages that resonate with them. Now, additionally, in the Inner Genius Toolkit is some tools to help you to find the right words and phrases for a specific situation. So if you practice and you really start to embrace it, you can create powerful messages that positively impact other people, just by using the tools just use the tools, you can get them today and use them today. Because I've made them really simple. Remember? I'm Australian, Carl, I make it really simple.
Carl Richards 12:39
How can we use this impactful structure to add value, influence and engage with others.
Catherine Mattiske 12:44
So one of the tools that I created, there's about 50 of them, okay, but one of the tools I created was the Inner Genius Wheel. And by utilizing the Inner Genius Wheel, you can really create those compelling messages that add value to your message, that influence and engage with other people. And you can use those tools to tailor your communication to the specific needs of the audience. Now, within also within that Toolkit, additionally, we give you powerful words and phrases that can really evoke emotion, and connect with your audience on a deeper level. Now, I'm just not talking about here some, you know, dodgy little job aid that's on an a4 piece of paper. When you open that Vault people go, "Holy Moly, look at all this!" There's a report all about your own Inner Genius Archetype. Everything's personalized to you. There's a Spotify playlist to help you get into your Genius Zone. And that's customized to you. But there's a full copy of my book there. There's Alexa Skills. There's lots and lots of things in that Toolkit. And one of the tools is that Inner Genius Wheel that ultimately if you did nothing more, but just use that Inner Genius Wheel, that'll help you become a way more impactful communicator, with every email, every presentation, every conversation, free, like difficult conversation, and ultimately been way more significant in your influence in the world.
Carl Richards 14:19
Moving on, Catherine, we are all obsessed with attending meetings, which fill or overflow in some cases, our calendars. However, most aren't productive. Let's be honest here. What have you found?
Catherine Mattiske 14:32
Well, most aren't productive, right? And so way back about 10 years ago, I decided that I would ban meetings in my company. Now I can just hear the shocks rippling around the world, like how does she run a company with no meetings? So I said, "I am not having meetings for meetings sake. I am never going to attend a meeting that you put in my calendar," this is to my team, "that says update meeting. I don't need to meet about that. Send me an email. Send me a report, I'll read it. I don't need to go to a meeting to be updated, I can read." And then I said, "I will only go to meetings if they are working meetings. If you want to work with me, and you want me to work with you, book all the meetings in your life, but I am not going to come to anything called a weekly update meeting, I'm just going to be there. And neither are you." So we banned them. And we said "waste of time."
So it was a courageous thing to do. But it gave us so much more time back by saying these are the meetings that we need to care about, that we're actually working together. But there's really successful meetings out there that I see people, and there's really terrible meetings. And I experienced a meeting that was completely unproductive. And it was only about a week ago. And it was on Zoom and everyone in the room, like in the Zoom Room, seemed to be talking over each other and there seemed to be a complete lack of clarity or direction as to what the goal of the meeting was. And I was just there, and I'm going "what is going on here?" And even after attending that meeting, I was still really unclear on what had been discussed and what had been accomplished. And it felt like an a- really unfortunate waste of time and energy.
And the experience really drove home the importance of creating that clear communication; having meaningful conversations, and adding value to have an impact. And that meeting that I went to got a 0 out of 10 on all of those scales. And when we're more focused on exchanging facts and data, rather than engaging in meaningful conversations that could lead to productive outcomes, then why do we need a meeting to exchange facts and data? Send me the presentation, I can read that, or send me an email, send me a Slack message. That's the facts and data. If you want to have a meaningful conversation and work together, then I'm all up for it. Like I'll book a coffee chatting with anybody to do that. I'll book a meeting to do that, but if you're just exchanging facts and data with me, we don't need a meeting, just send me an email. And for that particular meeting, an email would have sufficed. I would have read that email in probably two minutes. And yet I sat through that meeting for 90 minutes. And, you know, it was really painful.
Carl Richards 17:29
Are there any easy ways of successfully conveying information and understanding others?
Catherine Mattiske 17:35
Just think about that meeting scenario. So if that person leading the meeting, in very loose terms, leading the meeting, there wasn't much leadership there. But if they had just thought, "okay, I'm going to plan this out." If they had known their own Inner Genius Archetype, and done a Team Map, it was their team that was at the meeting , and they done a Team Map of their team's Inner Genius Archetype and they had used the Inner Genius Wheel, they would have crafted out a meeting agenda, which was absent by the way. They would have created the connection engagement with everybody.
And even in a really busy meeting setting that would have set them up for success in that meeting. And I think if they'd done that, they could have reduced that meeting to probably an hour or even 45 minutes, because there was so much faffing around in that meeting, which is a very Australian term, "faffing around", but wasting time and they could have created a lot more connection and reduced all the communication. Now, the first thing is, when you go into a meeting, turn off every distraction around you. Put your phone on silent, or put it in your bag or get it off the meeting table. Or even if you're on Zoom, get it off your desk. Turn everything off that beeps so that you don't get distracted, shut your email down, and be present, both physically and mentally, not just physically. How many times do you see on Zoom, or Teams, whatever you're using, and if you're in a physical meeting room, people doing other things. Your brain cannot multitask. You're either actively listening, or you're not. There's no such thing as multitasking, that's an absolute fallacy. So you can't be doing your emails and just kind of going, "oh, yeah, I'm listening." No you're not. You're doing your emails. You can't be doing both. What your brain is doing is shuffling between the speaker speaking and your emails, speaker speaking, emails. And it's going so rapidly, like multiple times a second, that's what's happening. It's exhausting for your brain so just do one thing at a time. Focus on what you're doing.
The second thing is practice empathy. So, try to put yourself in the other person's shoes by seeing things from their perspective. Now, if they are wildly different to you, or there's a bit of a battle going on, just take the time, take a breath and understand the person's perspective before you respond, okay? By having that deeper understanding of the person, you can then better tailor your communication and create those meaningful conversations, then that have impact. So once you've got your Inner Genius Archetype, if you're leading the meeting, structure it out using the Inner Genius Wheel, it will take you five minutes, if you just follow the structure of the wheel, your meeting will be way more successful on the outcomes of the meeting, the connection with people in the meeting, and the engagement in the meeting, it's a winner.
And you'll look like a star instead of how we all viewed that leader at that meeting that I went to for that 90 minutes, I actually saw that leader in a whole new light. And I'd never seen him in that light, because one on one with me, he was completely confident, completely engaged. But in that meeting, all over the shop, it was just really an eye opener. So my respect for him really went down, because he was just out of his depth with this meeting. And all he had to do was prepare and keep things moving along and just know who was in the room, it was actually quite simple, but he just didn't have the skills.
Carl Richards 21:35
And it probably could have been a shorter meeting, too, with the skill sets and all of those things that are- all those tools, you know, that are in the Toolkit. So, what tips do you have for people to become better communicators, then speaking of presentations, how to become better communicators in presentations.
Catherine Mattiske 21:52
I think presentations are different to like meetings and emails and everything else. So presenting often is a quite a fearful thing for many people. So I think for me, what I tell people is there's three main components of the communication, when you're presenting.
Firstly is having confidence, if you can just get confident. So if you are the subject matter expert in what you're presenting, that will give you confidence, if you're not, then become more of an expert, so that you feel that confidence that people can ask you anything. And even if you have to say, "I don't know, but I'll find out." That you can say that with confidence.
The second thing is preparation, getting prepared. But the third thing is also your speaking skills. So you can build your self confidence. Firstly, I think by just believing in yourself and trusting that you're going to make an impact on your audience with your words. And the second one is preparation. So many people present and they're unprepared. So plan what you want to say and practice beforehand, and use the Inner Genius Wheel to do that. So there's a tool there for you to use that Inner Genius Wheel. And by using the wheel, you're not just presenting to just people who are your Inner Genius Archetype, you're presenting to all Archetypes. That's what the wheel does, it creates what I refer to as Balanced Communication.
So when you prepare your presentation using the Inner Genius Wheel, it means that you will have a structure that A.) Will flow and B.) Will hit all of those Archetypes. So, those people will feel like "wow!" You're talking to them, because you've prepared for them. But lastly, I think speaking skills are the key. And even if you are prepared, your body language can give you a way with your lack of confidence. So use your body language and your facial expressions to connect with the audience. Be really mindful of your tone of voice and your volume. And make sure that before you even start your presentation, that you've created this really comfortable environment where people can openly exchange ideas. They can ask questions, they can comment on things and so on that it's a really open environment.
All of those things will help you with your speaking skills. And if you are fearful of speaking, speaking is a skill. And I know lots of people in senior positions who enroll to go to Toastmasters. Now, Toastmasters has been around for, you know, 1000 years. And so it's probably not, but you know, a long time and you can't beat just the basics of speaking skills. If you don't feel confident as a speaker, it's a skill you can get confident because all through your life you're asked to speak. You're asked to speak at family events, you're asked to speak at work, you're asked to speak with friends, so get good at speaking, it's a great skill to have. How can we apply your insights to our daily communication practices and things like phone calls? Yeah so, you can use this in emails, phone calls, meetings and I think the overarching thing is the first, as I've been saying, consider the audience, even on a phone call, think about your aim. Before you dial that number, or press that person's contact details on your phone, just stop and go, "okay, what's my goal here? What do I want out of this phone call?" And focus on that.
Secondly, be really mindful of your tone. So over the phone, or over virtual calls like this on Zoom, be very mindful of your tone because things can get really skewed really easily. So try to come from a place of kindness and understanding. And you need to dial up those active listening skills to demonstrate that you're really paying attention. And you're open to the other person's perspective. And as I said, right at the beginning, keep things really clear and really concise, don't overcomplicate your message. And don't bog people down with unnecessary detail. Just get to the point.
Carl Richards 26:19
Phenomenal. Many of us Catherine (are) overwhelmed by emails, emails, emails. We send and reply as quickly as possible. And often people respond with even more questions or more detail than we need, which causes frustration. What can we do to craft the perfect emails?
Catherine Mattiske 26:35
So, Fast Company interviewed me for a series called "Secrets of The Most Productive People." Doesn't make it sound like a seductive series that they ran? So when I was being interviewed by the Fast Company journalist, I talked about stopping what I call Email Ping-Pong, once and for all.
And because we all get tired of spending our days going back and forth by email. And highly productive people do not play Email Ping-Pong. So in order to reduce that frustration, it comes back to preparation; using the wheel. And before you press send, consider if you can anticipate any potential questions from the receiver. If there's some additional details that might help to avoid future email confusion, then include them right then, without overwhelming people with unnecessary detail. If you find yourself playing Email Ping-Pong more than once or twice, jump on a call or schedule a meeting, so that you can further discuss it.
I have the Rule of Three. If we go back two or three times, it's game over, I'm not playing that game anymore. I pick up the phone, I jump on to Slack, I book on a Zoom call and say, "can you chat?" And so, in our Slack, we can just put a Zoom link, bang, and they come straight into the meeting. I know they're at their desk, because they've been emailing me. So I know they're there. I don't need them to look glamorous, I don't need them to look beautiful. I don't need to have beautiful stage lighting, I just need to fix the problem. So get on straight onto a call. That keeps both parties on the same page. It's avoiding unnecessary emails and by using the wheel, you'll be able to craft those messages and get to the point quickly. And that means everyone's working more efficiently together.
Carl Richards 28:28
What advice would you give to people who have difficulty communicating effectively in stressful situations?
Catherine Mattiske 28:33
Well, I think we all sort of go to water, don't we, when we're in that stressful situation. Everything can become muddled, confusing, and you say things you don't mean to say, and so on. But again, focus. Focus on the purpose of the conversation, get to the goal, and try not to get distracted. You know, take a breath and get back to your goal. Use the wheel to plan your message, get on the same page with the person that you're talking to, or the group that you're talking to. Having that structured approach will help you get back on track.
And also, it takes the guesswork out of figuring out how to best communicate. And you can focus on expressing your ideas in a really effective way. So, speaking in a language that's accessible to your audience is not necessarily your own. And so you want to make sure that everyone understands your message, and that at the end of the day, they're taking those necessary action steps that you want them to take.
Carl Richards 29:38
You mentioned the Inner Genius Wheel. Are there other tools there for presentations?
Catherine Mattiske 29:42
Yes. So when you go into your Vault, you'll see the Inner Genius Wheel and then we have an entire curriculum of programs depending on who you are, what your role is. So we have Executive Programs and Sales Programs and Professional Programs, Short programs, Digital Programs, there's a whole lot. And there's a couple of the tools that are in a few of the programs that the presentation side of it is the presentation planner, and a PowerPoint template that's pre populated using the Inner Genius structure. So basically, it's a wheel put onto a series of slides with prompts. So you basically fill in the gaps on the slides. So it really is colour by numbers.
And so, I had a client, and she had a really big opportunity coming up, and she was on one of our courses, Discover Your Genius Quotient. And she was scheduled to present her idea for a new project to the board of directors. And it was such an important audience, she wanted her presentation to be really informative and really engaging and really stand out. But the goal was she needed approval for a $600,000 budget, right? That was her goal.
So in class, we'd done the piece on presenting and using the presentation template. And she said, "I'm going to use this not my company template." Which I thought was a bit of a brave move. It was the day before her presentation. She'd prepped everything up in the company template, she got the Inner Genius one and went "I'm just going to use that." And I said, "hang on, you need to rebrand that to your company, which you can do." and she said "I don't have time!" I went "okay you do you." Okay? So, that's fine. She used the template and she was able to organize her thoughts really well. And it looked very different to what her own previous preparation had looked like. But she crafted a really powerful narrative that won over the board of directors, she asked for a $600,000 budget, and they gave her 750,000. So she actually got way more budget because they loved it. And they went "well, won't you need some money for this and won't you need money for that? Well, we'll just add another 150." She called me afterwards and she said, "you'll never believe what happened."
And she used it as the framework that- that PowerPoint presentation, which is the adaptation of the wheel, she used that to really explain her ideas and that made all the difference in her presentation. She was so thrilled with the outcome. And she said to me "I don't know what you've got in that template, but it's a total winner. And I'm never using anything else." So she said, "I don't know what you've got in that template." She said, "I don't need to worry about that. I'm just going to follow it." So I think her experience proved that the tools and templates are incredibly powerful tools for this whole thing about effective communication. And not only did it help Alice structure her content, but it also enabled her to communicate her thoughts in a way that resonated with who she described as the stuffy board members. So I was really thrilled for her.
Carl Richards 32:53
I love that story. And that tool, I actually have a presentation coming up in September and Man oh man, if it can have that much impact. Why would you not want to use that template? So I'll have to definitely check that out. What strategies can be used to create an emotional connection with our audiences?
Catherine Mattiske 33:12
Yeah I think that's really the Secret Sauce, you know, you can prepare or you like that, you got to get that emotional connection. And I have something called Start Before You Start and tell stories. Like tell stories, good stories. So build the connection with your audience before you actually start your presentation. As soon as the first person walks in the door or joins a Zoom call, imagine they're coming into your home and having dinner with you. You're not going to just say, "sit at the dining room table and wait for everybody else." You're going to talk to them. So do the same when you're in a zoom call or when you're in a meeting room, build that connection, listen to them. Ask them questions, ask them for their ideas, you can then build that back into your presentation.
And use language to appeal to people's senses and make sure that your visual aids are really good and engaging. And if you're not great at doing slides, sometimes you're better off not using them. If your slides are really bad. Don't use them. Just remember that you are the number one visual aid in a presentation. You are the number one thing that people will look to you. Your slides support you in your presentation. They're not the presentation. You are the number one visual aid.
Carl Richards 34:30
Wow, we have unbundled so much today, Catherine, thank you so much for sharing your insights today. How can people get in touch with you if they have questions after today?
Catherine Mattiske 34:39
Really easy. So, go to my LinkedIn Profile, send me a message that's easy. You can also join the LinkedIn group, the Genius Zone, and we share a lot of articles and a lot of great content on the Genius Zone. I write every week to a LinkedIn newsletter called the GQ Playbook and you can subscribe to that. You can also go to our website, which is Thegeniusquotient.com. And also, we've just launched the GQ Academy. And so that link will also be in chat for you as well. Right now it's free to join. There, you'll find all of my blogs, press articles, where I've guested on podcasts, all sorts of things. So there's loads of ways to get in touch.
Carl Richards 35:22
Catherine, thank you so much. Again, it's been a pleasure having you here today, sharing with us about how to become a more confident communicator with the help of our Inner Genius Profile. So, we have learned so so much today. Thank you for your insights, your inspiration, all of the ideas. Let's use our Inner Genius to create compelling communication today. Well, not just today, but every day. So, keep a lookout for our next session, our Audio Rooms or our programs. There's more to come. But definitely thank you so much for joining us today. We'll see you next time.
Catherine Mattiske 35:55
Thanks, Carl. Thanks everybody.
Carl Richards 35:59
Thanks for listening to the Genius Zone. If you liked what you heard today, leave us a comment or review. Make sure to subscribe to our channel and don't forget to follow Catherine on social media. Be sure to join us again soon in the Genius Zone.